Author Topic: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order  (Read 4530 times)

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« on: February 14, 2018, 11:47:22 AM »
OK I am tearing my hair out here - I can usually fiddle though stuff or work out why I cant but I am at a dead end.

In my navigator and favourites panel I want the folders in date order - preferably with the newest at the top but hey I will settle for anything right now.  I just cannot get this to happen - unless I have the folders as dated only and I am trying to get away from that.

I have just overhauled my workflow to reduce time and storage waste.  I have previously ingested photos into dated folders with the image names being the date, processed the chosen ones, then copied the jpgs to a named folder, with a subfolder for smaller file copies used online which were renamed for their specific event (yes complicated I know) and the folders went into date order fine.   I am trying to switch to named folders of "event {iptcmonthname3}{iptcday}{iptcyear}" with photos named the same with a sequence.  Then a subfolder with jpgs and a sub-subfolder of small files.  My problem is that the named folders will not go into date order.  Nor are they in alphabetical order.  Nor are they in order last used (I deliberately opened the folders and sent stuff to Flickr in date order to see if that was the problem.)

I have folders that are supposed to be date descending that go 12, 7,6,9,10 (all February) or first letter of name D,B,T,B,F.

My windows folder is set on date descending and the folders are correct in that view - I see the newest first.

In looking for solutions to this I came across a thread about setting preferences in the navigator and favourites tab by right clicking in them and selecting preferences - when I do this the only thing that comes up is to display hidden files and display system files, there is nothing about setting the order of the folders.

I am using photo mechanic 5 build 19094.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 21908
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2018, 01:51:22 PM »
Would you mind posting a screen shot of your Navigator showing the problem?  Use the 'Attachments and other options' link when you're composing your reply to this message and there you'll be able to upload your JPEG format screenshot.

Thanks,

-Kirk

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2018, 04:48:47 AM »
Sure.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 21908
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2018, 07:58:22 AM »
Sure.

Thanks.  And could you post a screenshot of how Windows Explorer orders them?

-Kirk

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2018, 10:40:02 AM »
I have done 2 one in my normal view and one with list arrangement as it is easier to see

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 21908
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2018, 01:13:23 PM »
OK, thanks for the screenshots.  The date sorting that PM is doing is in regards to the modification date of the folders with no regard to the name of the folder.  It appears that Windows Explorer is looking for dates or numbers in the names of the folders and then sorting them numerically.

PM's name sorting uses an alphabetical sort with no special treatment of dates or numbers.

None of these sort methods are going to give you the same result as what you're getting in Windows Explorer.

-Kirk

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2018, 02:06:13 PM »
I thought that might be the case and deliberately modified the folders in the order I wanted them -so modified oldest, then next oldest etc etc - and it made no difference to the order the folders were/are arranged in.  Modifying the folders does not change the order they are arranged in - if it did I would be able to work with that.

As far as I am aware windows explorer does not use dates in the name but rather creation date of folder, as all folders will arrange regardless of whether there is a date in the name.  It does not use modification dates because it does not rearrange them when/if I modify the folders.


Offline Woodie

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 143
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2018, 02:18:37 PM »
If you want them to sort in date order in Windows, the folder or filename needs to start with the date in YYYYMMDD order I believe. I'm pretty sure Windows sorts by ASCII characters, left to right. If you use alpha-numeric dates, with the month first, April will be the first month followed by August, etc. in alphabetic order. Maybe I'm all wet in my thinking. Someone please correct this if I'm off the mark.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 21908
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2018, 06:14:06 PM »
I thought that might be the case and deliberately modified the folders in the order I wanted them -so modified oldest, then next oldest etc etc - and it made no difference to the order the folders were/are arranged in.  Modifying the folders does not change the order they are arranged in - if it did I would be able to work with that.

As far as I am aware windows explorer does not use dates in the name but rather creation date of folder, as all folders will arrange regardless of whether there is a date in the name.  It does not use modification dates because it does not rearrange them when/if I modify the folders.

The Favorites and Navigator use modification time to date sort.  This has the effect of making the most recently modified folders move to the top/bottom (depending on the order you've chosen.)  This is useful for some workflows and not others.  It is not useful for yours.

If you were to rename your folders as Woodie suggested and then use one of the Name sorts then you would get a consistent ordering controlled by the date prefixing your folder names.  If they're all from the same year, then you could omit the four digit year if you like.  But the Month and Day should be numeric with a leading zero for best results.

HTH,

-Kirk

Offline jwvaughn

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • Retired programmer
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2018, 09:51:44 PM »
A suggestion...

I prefer my folders in date order so I set them up with the following ingest folder:

{year2}{month0}{day0} XXXX\Original

The variables return, for instance, 20180215 and the XXXX I replace with a short subject following ingest.  Since I shoot raw, the picture files o in the subfolder Orignal.

It has really helped me keep my organiztion straight, the folders are in an order that make sense to me and. it happens automattically during ingest.

Jerry

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2018, 05:50:00 AM »
If you want them to sort in date order in Windows, the folder or filename needs to start with the date in YYYYMMDD order I believe. I'm pretty sure Windows sorts by ASCII characters, left to right. If you use alpha-numeric dates, with the month first, April will be the first month followed by August, etc. in alphabetic order. Maybe I'm all wet in my thinking. Someone please correct this if I'm off the mark.
Windows does date order fine without needing to name or anything - windows is not the problem (wow can't believe I typed that lol)
I thought that might be the case and deliberately modified the folders in the order I wanted them -so modified oldest, then next oldest etc etc - and it made no difference to the order the folders were/are arranged in.  Modifying the folders does not change the order they are arranged in - if it did I would be able to work with that.

As far as I am aware windows explorer does not use dates in the name but rather creation date of folder, as all folders will arrange regardless of whether there is a date in the name.  It does not use modification dates because it does not rearrange them when/if I modify the folders.

The Favorites and Navigator use modification time to date sort.  This has the effect of making the most recently modified folders move to the top/bottom (depending on the order you've chosen.)  This is useful for some workflows and not others.  It is not useful for yours.

If you were to rename your folders as Woodie suggested and then use one of the Name sorts then you would get a consistent ordering controlled by the date prefixing your folder names.  If they're all from the same year, then you could omit the four digit year if you like.  But the Month and Day should be numeric with a leading zero for best results.

HTH,

-Kirk


Modification time sort would be brilliant - but it is not doing that either.  I can work with a flat date order or modification time order - either would be fine.

Again I have deliberately modified all the folders in the order I want to give them an order.  It made no difference.

I am fully aware that if I use dated folders they will organise - that is how I worked before - but I am trying to get away from that as it was difficult to find specific shoots when requested.  I still have problems if I put the numeric date in front of the name.  All I want is for the folders to arrange by date - either ingest date or modification date - but they do not.

Offline Jerry H

  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 188
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2018, 02:34:01 PM »
Modification time sort would be brilliant - but it is not doing that either.

I wasn't able recreate a problem with PM's Navigator or Favorites not sorting by folder modification time, ascending or descending. You'll need to refresh the Favorites/Navigator after any changes have been made to the folders within by right-clicking on the parent folder from inside the Favorites/Navigator and selecting Refresh from the contextual menu.

Note: In order for me to get Windows Explorer to list folders by date modified, I had to put Explorer in Details view and add the 'Date modified' column and then click on the Date modified column header before I was able to see my folders in their modification order.

If the issue persist after the folder refresh, then I suggest contacting our support folks at:

By email: support@camerabits.com

By phone: +1 503.547.2800

Hours: Mon-Fri, 9:00am-5:00pm [PST/PDT]

-Jerry

Offline Woodie

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 143
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2018, 05:40:53 PM »
Windows will handle date order ok if files are not moved around. Just to check, I moved a file from one folder to another and the file Date Created in the new location changed to today's date. The date modified remained the same. I opened an image in an editor, made no changes and saved it. The date modified changed to today's date. That's why I just date the files and folders with the EXIF capture date when I ingest so I can move and/or edit at will and keep the original capture date. Yes, I can go to the EXIF data and get the original date but it's simpler for me to put it in the file/folder name to start with.  I understand your workflow is different so this doesn't work for you. Sorry I can't help.


[/quote]
Windows does date order fine without needing to name or anything - windows is not the problem (wow can't believe I typed that lol)
I thought that might be the case and deliberately modified the folders in the order I wanted them -so modified oldest, then next oldest etc etc - and it made no difference to the order the folders were/are arranged in.  Modifying the folders does not change the order they are arranged in - if it did I would be able to work with that.

As far as I am aware windows explorer does not use dates in the name but rather creation date of folder, as all folders will arrange regardless of whether there is a date in the name.  It does not use modification dates because it does not rearrange them when/if I modify the folders.

The Favorites and Navigator use modification time to date sort.  This has the effect of making the most recently modified folders move to the top/bottom (depending on the order you've chosen.)  This is useful for some workflows and not others.  It is not useful for yours.

If you were to rename your folders as Woodie suggested and then use one of the Name sorts then you would get a consistent ordering controlled by the date prefixing your folder names.  If they're all from the same year, then you could omit the four digit year if you like.  But the Month and Day should be numeric with a leading zero for best results.

HTH,

-Kirk


Modification time sort would be brilliant - but it is not doing that either.  I can work with a flat date order or modification time order - either would be fine.

Again I have deliberately modified all the folders in the order I want to give them an order.  It made no difference.

I am fully aware that if I use dated folders they will organise - that is how I worked before - but I am trying to get away from that as it was difficult to find specific shoots when requested.  I still have problems if I put the numeric date in front of the name.  All I want is for the folders to arrange by date - either ingest date or modification date - but they do not.
[/quote]

Offline starsphinx

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Cannot get my folders to sort in date order
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2018, 11:27:59 AM »
Modification time sort would be brilliant - but it is not doing that either.

I wasn't able recreate a problem with PM's Navigator or Favorites not sorting by folder modification time, ascending or descending. You'll need to refresh the Favorites/Navigator after any changes have been made to the folders within by right-clicking on the parent folder from inside the Favorites/Navigator and selecting Refresh from the contextual menu.

Note: In order for me to get Windows Explorer to list folders by date modified, I had to put Explorer in Details view and add the 'Date modified' column and then click on the Date modified column header before I was able to see my folders in their modification order.

If the issue persist after the folder refresh, then I suggest contacting our support folks at:

By email: support@camerabits.com

By phone: +1 503.547.2800

Hours: Mon-Fri, 9:00am-5:00pm [PST/PDT]

-Jerry

The right click in the folder and refresh worked - I was not aware that existed.  Apologies for late response, I have been poorly.