Author Topic: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?  (Read 757 times)

Offline FFrankHB

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PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« on: December 19, 2019, 01:02:32 AM »
Hi,
I am new to PM and in my testing phase.
I am an amateur and want to speed up my workflow.
I work on Windows 8.1 (new PC on its way ;-))
PM Version is 6.0 build 3954
Most of my files are Panasonic RAW an JPG.

My Preferences are like in the picture.

How can I awoid to write XMP files.
Thanks for the help.

Best.
Fabian

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2019, 06:24:32 AM »
Set the "Allow RAW files to be modified" checkbox
Set the "Add embedded metadata:" checkbox (and then choose what types of metadata you want to embed)
Uncheck the "Always create and/or update XMP sidecar file" checkbox.

As for the types of embedded metadata, at this point in time you only need XMP.  IPTC is obsolete but is available for users who work with older software that needs it.

Beware though, that some software does not respond well to embedded metadata and may claim that your files are damaged.  XMP sidecar files are the "industry standard".

DNG files are an option if you're willing to convert your RAW files to DNG and they always use embedded XMP and XMP sidecar files are not created when adding/editing metadata on them.

HTH,

-Kirk

Offline FFrankHB

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2019, 06:34:26 AM »
Hi,

thanks for the quick reply.
Sadly no change in behaviour :-(
My preferences are attached.

Thanks for the hint about XMP Files. I am using DigiKam and never had problems without XMP. But I am an amateur... :-)

Best.
Fabian

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2019, 08:08:10 AM »
Fabian,

thanks for the quick reply.
Sadly no change in behaviour :-(
My preferences are attached.

Thanks for the hint about XMP Files. I am using DigiKam and never had problems without XMP. But I am an amateur... :-)

You'll have to delete any existing XMP files.  No more will be created.

-Kirk

Offline LarsN

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2019, 08:49:37 AM »
Kirk,

Fabian is stating that most of his files are Panasonic Raw files, i.e rw2 files. Below quote is from an earlier thread:

Quote
Embedding metadata on Panasonic RW2 files is not supported in PM.  We used to allow it but we turned off embedding because Photoshop CS6, CaptureOne, and Apple's ImageIO library all have problems with relocated TIFF tables on RW2 files (it's what has to happen to embed XMP into TIFF-based RAW files.)

Have this changed or have I got it wrong?

Lars

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2019, 08:56:48 AM »
Lars,

Fabian is stating that most of his files are Panasonic Raw files, i.e rw2 files. Below quote is from an earlier thread:

Quote
Embedding metadata on Panasonic RW2 files is not supported in PM.  We used to allow it but we turned off embedding because Photoshop CS6, CaptureOne, and Apple's ImageIO library all have problems with relocated TIFF tables on RW2 files (it's what has to happen to embed XMP into TIFF-based RAW files.)

Have this changed or have I got it wrong?

No, we still do not allow the embedding of XMP in RW2 files.

Fabian: PM will always add XMP sidecar files if your Panasonic RAW files are RW2 files, regardless of your IPTC/XMP preferences.  Too many applications had problems with embedded metadata so we had to disable it.

-Kirk

Offline FFrankHB

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2019, 04:16:54 PM »
Oh, this is sad...I really do not want to clutter my archive with more files. I am not the only one who is looking for pictures in this. I could deal with the extra files if I have to - but not the others.

Let me ask: What is written in the XMP what is not already in the RW2. I do not need more information in it than what the camera already is writing in it.
I just want to copy and rename all files in my well used system (I do it with downloader pro - but this Program is not really nice to use...).

Please let me do it without XMP...

The other chance to do would be to store the RAW (and XMP) files in an extra folder separated from the JPGs - but I really do not want this. And I do not know how to do this in PM - any help?
Thanks.
Best.
Fabian
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 05:00:12 PM by FFrankHB »

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2019, 05:33:48 PM »
Fabian,

Oh, this is sad...I really do not want to clutter my archive with more files. I am not the only one who is looking for pictures in this. I could deal with the extra files if I have to - but not the others.

Let me ask: What is written in the XMP what is not already in the RW2. I do not need more information in it than what the camera already is writing in it.

Any metadata you edit. Also, star ratings, color labels, GPS coordinates, the tag checkbox, etc.

I just want to copy and rename all files in my well used system (I do it with downloader pro - but this Program is not really nice to use...).

Please let me do it without XMP...

The other chance to do would be to store the RAW (and XMP) files in an extra folder separated from the JPGs - but I really do not want this. And I do not know how to do this in PM - any help?

I don't recommend separating your RAW files from your JPEGs.  It's too easy for the metadata to get out of sync.

Perhaps it's time for us to re-enable embedding XMP in RW2 files.  I'll talk this over with the team.

-Kirk

Offline FFrankHB

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2019, 02:56:02 PM »

I don't recommend separating your RAW files from your JPEGs.  It's too easy for the metadata to get out of sync.

Perhaps it's time for us to re-enable embedding XMP in RW2 files.  I'll talk this over with the team.

-Kirk

Ok, I will.not separate jpgs from raw. Seems logical.
Please consider to let the user choose if there are XMPs written for RW2 files or not. Maybe with a warning?

Is it possible to make the xmps invisible for normal.file operations? So if browsing with a file browser nobody gets confused because of all the extra files?
Thanks for great support even in evaluation!!!
F.

Offline FFrankHB

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2020, 12:28:19 PM »
Any news on this?
I am at the end of my trial...and would love to use PM - but I really want a solution for this...
Please!
Best.
F.

PS: Happy new year to all of you!!!

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2020, 06:13:10 PM »
Any news on this?
I am at the end of my trial...and would love to use PM - but I really want a solution for this...
Please!
Best.
F.

PS: Happy new year to all of you!!!

I just got back to work today.  I will discuss this issue at our development meeting tomorrow.

-Kirk

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2020, 04:22:55 PM »
We will be updating PM6 to embed XMP when XMP embedding is turned on.  There will be a "debug flag" that will make it possible to deny embedding XMP for Panasonic RAW files while allowing other RAW files to be modified for those people who work with multiple RAW formats, and need embedding on their other formats but cannot have their Panasonic RAW files to be modified.

-Kirk
« Last Edit: January 07, 2020, 04:44:44 PM by Kirk Baker »

Offline FFrankHB

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2020, 02:34:35 PM »
We will be updating PM6 to embed XMP when XMP embedding is turned on.  There will be a "debug flag" that will make it possible to deny embedding XMP for Panasonic RAW files while allowing other RAW files to be modified for those people who work with multiple RAW formats, and need embedding on their other formats but cannot have their Panasonic RAW files to be modified.

-Kirk
Thanks Kirk,
this is great news...I hope this update is not to far away...My trial is slowly comming to the end - but I want to make sure that all is working as I want before buying.
I have one more question - but this will get a new thread.
Great supportforum.
F.

Offline dennis

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2020, 05:23:45 PM »
We are testing this now.  It appears that modified files are no longer causing problems in other applications like Photoshop, CaptureOne, or Apple's ImageIO.

We will enable the modification of RAW files but you may still see the XMP sidecar files appear if other applications create them (like LightRoom etc).

Should be in the next release.

--dennis

Offline dodgeandburn

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Re: PM always is producing XMP-files. How stop this?
« Reply #14 on: Yesterday at 04:28:28 AM »
Well this is really great. I just posted an identical topic and removed it when I saw this one. I'm using Fuji RAW files though. I have all the settings for creating XMPs off like OP and it's still creating new XMP files upon ingesting. Looking forward to the new release.