Author Topic: NEF's lose ACR settings when copied  (Read 6063 times)

Offline dkern

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NEF's lose ACR settings when copied
« on: April 19, 2007, 08:34:31 PM »
For a few months I've been having problems with nefs that I edit, add metadata and rename in PhotoMechanic 4.4.3.2. I then apply my corrections in ACR (Photoshop CS, Camera Raw 2.4) in XP environment. Everything is fine if I go back to work on the files later. Weird things happen, however, when I copy the files in PhotoMechanic to another folder. When I open these files in ACR, some of the previews revert back to the default settings even though the XMP files have the corrected versions. It happens to random images in the new folder. If I process them to jpegs, the ones with the default previews convert uncorrected and the images with correct previews convert corrected even though they all have the identical corrections to the raw file listed in the xmp file. Somehow the xmp is being unlinked from the nef--filenames are the same but for some reason some of them aren't being recognized. If I then correct them again, they stay corrected unless I copy them to another folder with PhotoMechanic and then they may or may not transfer without defaulting back to the original as shot.

David

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: NEF's lose ACR settings when copied
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2007, 09:10:59 PM »
David,

For a few months I've been having problems with nefs that I edit, add metadata and rename in PhotoMechanic 4.4.3.2. I then apply my corrections in ACR (Photoshop CS, Camera Raw 2.4) in XP environment. Everything is fine if I go back to work on the files later. Weird things happen, however, when I copy the files in PhotoMechanic to another folder. When I open these files in ACR, some of the previews revert back to the default settings even though the XMP files have the corrected versions. It happens to random images in the new folder. If I process them to jpegs, the ones with the default previews convert uncorrected and the images with correct previews convert corrected even though they all have the identical corrections to the raw file listed in the xmp file. Somehow the xmp is being unlinked from the nef--filenames are the same but for some reason some of them aren't being recognized. If I then correct them again, they stay corrected unless I copy them to another folder with PhotoMechanic and then they may or may not transfer without defaulting back to the original as shot.

First, upgrade to version 4.4.3.3 since it is a free update and fixes several issues in 4.4.3.2.

Second, if you have PM embedding XMP metadata into your NEFs, then that is what is causing the problem.  With Adobe products it is best to use only XMP sidecars (you can embed IPTC if you wish) and never embed XMP.  Bridge and ACR prefer embedded XMP over XMP sidecar files, even though they don't update them.  This causes them to appear to 'lose' their settings, even though you correctly verified that your adjustments existed in the matching XMP sidecar file.  The presence of the embedded XMP metadata causes Bridge and ACR to ignore the sidecar files.  Thus when you don't embed XMP into your RAW files, the problem doesn't occur.

HTH,

-Kirk

Offline dkern

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Re: NEF's lose ACR settings when copied
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2007, 07:36:26 AM »
David,
First, upgrade to version 4.4.3.3 since it is a free update and fixes several issues in 4.4.3.2.

Second, if you have PM embedding XMP metadata into your NEFs, then that is what is causing the problem.  With Adobe products it is best to use only XMP sidecars (you can embed IPTC if you wish) and never embed XMP.  Bridge and ACR prefer embedded XMP over XMP sidecar files, even though they don't update them.  This causes them to appear to 'lose' their settings, even though you correctly verified that your adjustments existed in the matching XMP sidecar file.  The presence of the embedded XMP metadata causes Bridge and ACR to ignore the sidecar files.  Thus when you don't embed XMP into your RAW files, the problem doesn't occur.

HTH,

-Kirk


Kirk,

Thanks for your quick reply. I will upgrade to 4.4.3.3 as you suggested. Secondly, I don't recall ever tinkering with the XMP options in PM--just whatever the default has been. Here's a screen capture in case I'm wrong.http://www.davidkern.com/pm/settings.jpg Excuse my ignorance but is IPTC4XMP the XMP metadata? Is that what I should not be embedding?


Here's my workflow--has worked successfully for a long time. Ingest with PM with IPTC added, edit, adjust IPTC, rename, mark color-coded slects. Open and adjust raws in ACR (with XMP sidecars). Return to PM filter for selects, copy to selects folder. Open folder in ACR to check adjustments, use Pshop scripts to convert to jpegs and create websites. This has been working well for a year or two but the last few months there is a random loss of adjustments. Also, if I copy the select files to the new folder with Windows Explorer rather than PM, everything is fine. Is the problem generated when I return to PM to move the files and there is a conflict between the embedded XMP and the sidecars?

What should my settings be?

Thanks, David

Offline Kirk Baker

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Re: NEF's lose ACR settings when copied
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2007, 07:45:09 AM »
David,

First, upgrade to version 4.4.3.3 since it is a free update and fixes several issues in 4.4.3.2.

Second, if you have PM embedding XMP metadata into your NEFs, then that is what is causing the problem.  With Adobe products it is best to use only XMP sidecars (you can embed IPTC if you wish) and never embed XMP.  Bridge and ACR prefer embedded XMP over XMP sidecar files, even though they don't update them.  This causes them to appear to 'lose' their settings, even though you correctly verified that your adjustments existed in the matching XMP sidecar file.  The presence of the embedded XMP metadata causes Bridge and ACR to ignore the sidecar files.  Thus when you don't embed XMP into your RAW files, the problem doesn't occur.

HTH,

-Kirk


Kirk,

Thanks for your quick reply. I will upgrade to 4.4.3.3 as you suggested. Secondly, I don't recall ever tinkering with the XMP options in PM--just whatever the default has been. Here's a screen capture in case I'm wrong.http://www.davidkern.com/pm/settings.jpg Excuse my ignorance but is IPTC4XMP the XMP metadata? Is that what I should not be embedding?


Here's my workflow--has worked successfully for a long time. Ingest with PM with IPTC added, edit, adjust IPTC, rename, mark color-coded slects. Open and adjust raws in ACR (with XMP sidecars). Return to PM filter for selects, copy to selects folder. Open folder in ACR to check adjustments, use Pshop scripts to convert to jpegs and create websites. This has been working well for a year or two but the last few months there is a random loss of adjustments. Also, if I copy the select files to the new folder with Windows Explorer rather than PM, everything is fine. Is the problem generated when I return to PM to move the files and there is a conflict between the embedded XMP and the sidecars?

What should my settings be?

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Offline dkern

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Re: NEF's lose ACR settings when copied
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2007, 08:03:02 AM »
Kirk,

Don't you ever sleep? Thanks again for the quick and perfect reply. Fantastic customer service as always and I guess I'm now heading off to download PM 4.5 and re-up my year's update!

David