Author Topic: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window  (Read 4579 times)

Offline gavinfarrington

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PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« on: August 23, 2011, 04:48:46 PM »
Win7 64, PM 4.6.7

I've searched, but found nothing on this.

I run dual-monitors, so I task in/out of PM's preview window quite often.  In the past week or so, my workflow has really been mucked up because any time I task back in to PM, the app hangs for a full 25 seconds (timed on my watch.)  This is repeatable and 100% consistent.  The title bar actually adds the (Not Responding) message, and the spinning wheel replaces the mouse pointer.  The behavior is present whether I task out for mere seconds, or a long period of time.  The behavior is persistent through relaunches of the app, restarts of the computer, and uninstall/reinstall of PM.

I've not been able to replicate the behavior when tasking out/in of just the contact sheet, but I could test further if someone thinks it's a path worth exploring.



Thanks for your help!



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Online Kirk Baker

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2011, 05:33:22 PM »
Gavin,

I run dual-monitors, so I task in/out of PM's preview window quite often.  In the past week or so, my workflow has really been mucked up because any time I task back in to PM, the app hangs for a full 25 seconds (timed on my watch.)  This is repeatable and 100% consistent.  The title bar actually adds the (Not Responding) message, and the spinning wheel replaces the mouse pointer.  The behavior is present whether I task out for mere seconds, or a long period of time.  The behavior is persistent through relaunches of the app, restarts of the computer, and uninstall/reinstall of PM.

I've not been able to replicate the behavior when tasking out/in of just the contact sheet, but I could test further if someone thinks it's a path worth exploring.

Do you have free memory when you switch between applications?
How much RAM does your system have?
What applications are running at the same time as PM?
How much memory have you given to PM for its Memory Cache?

What kind of sort method are you using in the Contact Sheet window?
How many files are being modified before you come back to PM?

-Kirk

Offline gavinfarrington

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2011, 05:39:50 PM »
I have 12GB of RAM on a Core i7 920.  The OS and PM are installed to a 250GB SSD.  The RAW files are on a WD 2TB Black installed internally on SATA2.

As I write this (and experience the problem) I also have Google Chrome running, and am showing 72% of system memory available (28% used.)

I haven't modified PM's Memory Cache.  Shall I?  Recommended setting?

I use "capture time" as my default sort.  Would PM be resorting for some reason simply by tasking in/out?

I use PM only for culling, so I give "good" images a color flag, and "bad" images I skip.  There are no other edits taking place.  As for quantity - this seems to make no difference.  I can flag a hundred images, then task out/in, and the impact is identical to flagging no images (and not even progressing the preview window to the next frame.)

[Edited: typo]
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 05:42:51 PM by gavinfarrington »

Online Kirk Baker

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2011, 05:46:43 PM »
I have 12GB of RAM on a Core i7 920.  The OS and PM are installed to a 250GB SSD.  The RAW files are on a WD 2TB Black installed internally on SATA2.

As I write this (and experience the problem) I also have Google Chrome running, and am showing 72% of system memory available (28% used.)

I haven't modified PM's Memory Cache.  Shall I?  Recommended setting?

I suggest 768 MB for your particular system.

Quote from: gavinfarrington
I use "capture time" as my default sort.  Would PM be resorting for some reason simply by tasking in/out?

That is my suspicion, and Capture Time sorting is by far the slowest sort that PM offers besides the custom sorts that use variables.

Quote from: gavinfarrington
I use PM only for culling, so I give "good" images a color flag, and "bad" images I skip.  There are no other edits taking place.  As for quantity - this seems to make no difference.  I can flag a hundred images, then task out/in, and the impact is identical to flagging no images (and not even progressing the preview window to the next frame.)

OK, so what takes place when you switch out of PM before you switch back in?

-Kirk

Offline gavinfarrington

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2011, 06:00:54 PM »
OK, I've updated the Memory Cache setting to 768MB, and I've changed the default sort to "by filename."  I've also changed the actual applied sort in the contact sheet to "filename," and relaunched PM to make sure everything sticks.

OK, so what takes place when you switch out of PM before you switch back in?

I'll give you an example.  At this moment I can go to PM, hit <alt> <tab> to flip to this window in Chrome, then immediately <alt> <tab> back to PM and it triggers.  It doesn't matter which other app I switch to, or that I do nothing there.  The switch alone seems to cause it.

Changing the default sort and memory cache doesn't seem to have helped.

Oh and I've just verified that the same behavior occurs from the contact sheet window as well.

Not sure if this is relevant, but my contact sheet is "folder and subfolders."

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2011, 06:24:57 PM »
OK, I've updated the Memory Cache setting to 768MB, and I've changed the default sort to "by filename."  I've also changed the actual applied sort in the contact sheet to "filename," and relaunched PM to make sure everything sticks.

OK, so what takes place when you switch out of PM before you switch back in?

I'll give you an example.  At this moment I can go to PM, hit <alt> <tab> to flip to this window in Chrome, then immediately <alt> <tab> back to PM and it triggers.  It doesn't matter which other app I switch to, or that I do nothing there.  The switch alone seems to cause it.

Changing the default sort and memory cache doesn't seem to have helped.

Oh and I've just verified that the same behavior occurs from the contact sheet window as well.

Not sure if this is relevant, but my contact sheet is "folder and subfolders."

What happens if you use a simple contact sheet of a single folder and no sub-folders?  I know that's not what you want to do, but let's just test for now.

-Kirk

Offline gavinfarrington

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2011, 09:45:22 AM »
Good morning, Kirk   :)

So I did what you asked, and tested with a single subfolder that has no further subfolders.  This one folder represents roughly half of the total number of files for the job.  When tasking out then back in, I notice the delay, but it's much shorter than before.

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2011, 10:26:09 AM »
Gavin,

So I did what you asked, and tested with a single subfolder that has no further subfolders.  This one folder represents roughly half of the total number of files for the job.  When tasking out then back in, I notice the delay, but it's much shorter than before.

Then it is likely that the time is being spent scanning your folder(s) for new or changed files.  Opening fewer folder(s) containing fewer files will reduce this time accordingly.

-Kirk

Offline gavinfarrington

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2011, 10:55:14 AM »
Bummer.  I use PM because it performs so well.  This is kind of a headache.  Is there anything else I can do to speed it up?  Settings or something?   :(

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2011, 11:01:10 AM »
Gavin,

Bummer.  I use PM because it performs so well.  This is kind of a headache.  Is there anything else I can do to speed it up?  Settings or something?   :(

No.  PM rescans the folders of all open contact sheets each time it is resumed.  The more folders/files, the longer it takes.  Is the drive you're accessing local and fast?  Even if it is a fast drive, can you break your work up into smaller chunks?

-Kirk

Offline gavinfarrington

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2011, 11:37:15 AM »
The WD 2TB Black drives were on MaximumPC's best-of-the-best list for nearly a full year.  It's only recently been outstripped by Hitachi's 3TB desktstar drives.  It's no SSD, but it's good in terms of magnetic drives.

I use PM to run my first pass of culling on weddings because of it's great performance previewing RAW files.  All my RAWs are converted to DNG.  Are there any little nuances such as leaving them .CR2 until I finish with PM, or anything else that may help?

Generally I'm dealing with 2500 - 5000 images per event.

Thanks for taking your time with this one.

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2011, 02:35:27 PM »
Gavin,

The WD 2TB Black drives were on MaximumPC's best-of-the-best list for nearly a full year.  It's only recently been outstripped by Hitachi's 3TB desktstar drives.  It's no SSD, but it's good in terms of magnetic drives.

I use PM to run my first pass of culling on weddings because of it's great performance previewing RAW files.  All my RAWs are converted to DNG.  Are there any little nuances such as leaving them .CR2 until I finish with PM, or anything else that may help?

Generally I'm dealing with 2500 - 5000 images per event.

Thanks for taking your time with this one.

It's just a matter of the number of files that PM can scan for filesystem attributes per second that is the issue.  Let's say that on your system PM can get filesystem attributes for 100 files per second.  With 5,000 files, PM will then take 50 seconds to get the data from the filesystem, thus the inconvenience in switching back into PM.  Fewer files = less time waiting to switch back in.

Now if your take was 2,500 images and they're all CR2s, and you convert them to DNGs, at least convert them into a different location so that your folder doesn't now contain 5,000 files.  You can always browse the final converted files later after you've made your culling pass.

HTH,

-Kirk

Offline William R Wood

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2011, 09:26:29 AM »
Win7 64, PM 4.6.7

I've searched, but found nothing on this.

I run dual-monitors, so I task in/out of PM's preview window quite often.  In the past week or so, my workflow has really been mucked up because any time I task back in to PM, the app hangs for a full 25 seconds (timed on my watch.)  This is repeatable and 100% consistent.  The title bar actually adds the (Not Responding) message, and the spinning wheel replaces the mouse pointer.  The behavior is present whether I task out for mere seconds, or a long period of time.  The behavior is persistent through relaunches of the app, restarts of the computer, and uninstall/reinstall of PM.

I've not been able to replicate the behavior when tasking out/in of just the contact sheet, but I could test further if someone thinks it's a path worth exploring.



Thanks for your help!



I have a similar computer- Win7, 64bit, i930, 12GB RAM, fast magnetic internal hard drives.  My PM disk cache is 2048MB and the memory cache is 1024MB.  Running PM 4.6.7.  But I only use one monitor.

I currently have 3 contact sheets open: first has 343 files, second has 3896 files, third has 5019 files open.  These are folders and subfolders.  Two are sorted by Filename, biggest is sorted Capture time.  Most of the files are CR2s about 15MB in size.

I cannot duplicate your issue.  I can Alt-Tab to/from other programs (browser, email, catalog software, ExifTool, etc) and then task back to PM previews or contact sheet and PM shows no delay whatsoever. 

Maybe there is something about your dual monitor setup that is causing the issue?

Regards

Bill Wood

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2011, 09:36:34 AM »
Bill,

Win7 64, PM 4.6.7

I've searched, but found nothing on this.

I run dual-monitors, so I task in/out of PM's preview window quite often.  In the past week or so, my workflow has really been mucked up because any time I task back in to PM, the app hangs for a full 25 seconds (timed on my watch.)  This is repeatable and 100% consistent.  The title bar actually adds the (Not Responding) message, and the spinning wheel replaces the mouse pointer.  The behavior is present whether I task out for mere seconds, or a long period of time.  The behavior is persistent through relaunches of the app, restarts of the computer, and uninstall/reinstall of PM.

I've not been able to replicate the behavior when tasking out/in of just the contact sheet, but I could test further if someone thinks it's a path worth exploring.



Thanks for your help!



I have a similar computer- Win7, 64bit, i930, 12GB RAM, fast magnetic internal hard drives.  My PM disk cache is 2048MB and the memory cache is 1024MB.  Running PM 4.6.7.  But I only use one monitor.

I currently have 3 contact sheets open: first has 343 files, second has 3896 files, third has 5019 files open.  These are folders and subfolders.  Two are sorted by Filename, biggest is sorted Capture time.  Most of the files are CR2s about 15MB in size.

I cannot duplicate your issue.  I can Alt-Tab to/from other programs (browser, email, catalog software, ExifTool, etc) and then task back to PM previews or contact sheet and PM shows no delay whatsoever. 

Maybe there is something about your dual monitor setup that is causing the issue?

Dual monitors should not make any difference.  I have three monitors on my development system and the resume behavior is dependent on how quickly a given set of folders can be scanned for filesystem information.

-Kirk

Offline Hayo Baan

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Re: PM Hangs when tasking back to preview window
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2011, 09:55:02 AM »
Hi Kirk,

Would it be an idea to make it an option not to have PM rescan the folder upon reactivation?

While I generally do not have folders with more than say 500 images in them, I do suffer from this behaviour too when I e.g., combined a lot of folders into one contact sheet. Extremely large files (which I do have quite a lot) seem to cause longer scan times too.

Anyway, an option not to automatically rescan could be helpful.

Cheers,
    Hayo
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Web: www.hayobaan.nl