Author Topic: Catalog Reintegration  (Read 3187 times)

Offline BrianK

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Catalog Reintegration
« on: May 12, 2022, 04:50:48 AM »
My workflow is unusual it seems, maybe I'm the only one with an NAS. Due to the recommendation that catalogues aren't saved and retrieved using the NAS and to allow me to use 2 computers (Macs), but not at the same time, I now do this...
iMac - catalogs are stored and used on local HDD. The catalogs are synchronised to Google drive after PM+ is closed. This works okay and stores the catalogs intact. I also backup the catalogs separately to the NAS.
MacBook Pro in another room - I now sync the catalog files to the local HDD from Google drive. The files are available locally (the option is set in the Mac finder window). Next I open PM+ and go to catalog management to reintegrate the files.
My problems...
There are 8 catalogs with different numbers of proxy files ranging from a few hundred to a few thousand.
Problem 1 - Several catalogs start to reintegrate then hang at around 92%. I close the catalog management window and re-open it and the reintegration is still hung! This still happens even if PM+ is quit and reopened.
Problem 2 - After a successful reintegration on one catalog I then have to do this process again after successfully reintegrating another catalog then again after doing a third and so on ad infinitum.
Any ideas from anyone or CameraBits techies?

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 25020
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2022, 06:51:38 AM »
Are you using Collections?

If not, then you are better off just having similar catalogs on both systems.  You won't need to reintegrate anymore.

-Kirk

Offline BrianK

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2022, 11:50:52 AM »
Hi Kirk
That doesn't seem to work. I can't show any images in a 'top level' catalog, only from collections!
I created a new blank catalog and copied an image to it, the figures show an image is there in the 'Catalog Management' tool but it doesn't display.
As I've now got probably in the region of 100 collections and am still cataloguing my images so can assume adding more collections it really doesn't seem feasible to go through everything again to change to catalogs if I can't then see them.
Why would you put an option for collections and not have them work correctly. I have already changed my workflow (as described) to accommodate the inability of the software to work across a network. I feel that the software is a wonderful concept but it does need to be developed to work with most modern systems.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 25020
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2022, 01:05:11 PM »
Brian,

That doesn't seem to work.

I didn't tell you to do something, I asked a question.  What is it that I suggested that doesn't work?

I can't show any images in a 'top level' catalog, only from collections!

This I don't understand, what is a 'top level catalog'?  So you're using collections and they're the only way you can view your images?  Search/Browse/Filter operations produce no images?  Do you just want to see all of the images in your catalog at once?  If so, you can use the Search feature and search for ""

I created a new blank catalog and copied an image to it, the figures show an image is there in the 'Catalog Management' tool but it doesn't display.

What are these figures?

As I've now got probably in the region of 100 collections and am still cataloguing my images so can assume adding more collections it really doesn't seem feasible to go through everything again to change to catalogs if I can't then see them.

If you're only using the Collections feature, then having separate catalogs won't be a solution for your shared computer environment.

Why would you put an option for collections and not have them work correctly.

In what way aren't they working correctly?

I have already changed my workflow (as described) to accommodate the inability of the software to work across a network. I feel that the software is a wonderful concept but it does need to be developed to work with most modern systems.

In what aspect doesn't it work across a network?  It's capable of working with your images on a network.

-Kirk

Offline BrianK

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2022, 03:37:16 AM »
"I didn't tell you to do something, I asked a question.  What is it that I suggested that doesn't work?"
I misunderstood your response, yes, I am using collections, as I understand the way PM+ works, collections are nested within the catalogs.

"This I don't understand, what is a 'top level catalog'?"
I call the catalog that contains multiple collections as a 'top-level' catalog.

"So you're using collections and they're the only way you can view your images?"
I realise there are various ways to view my collections using search/browse/filter but I want to see my collection using the named collection eg. 'clouds' or 'deer' without resorting to the other functions i.e. from the collection name.

"What are these figures?"
a figure appeared in brackets alongside the catalogue name - I mistook this for and image count when it appears it's a selected collection number.

"If you're only using the Collections feature, then having separate catalogs won't be a solution for your shared computer environment."
Please explain why it won't be, bearing in mind I want a catalog of say 'Transport' images broken down to collections of say 'Flight', Waterborne', 'Rail' etc.

"In what aspect doesn't it work across a network?  It's capable of working with your images on a network."
I can see the 'Navigator' images from the NAS okay on both Macs. It's the Catalogs/Collections side that I have been advised not to use on the NAS as the number of read/write operations can be too much for the connections. This is the reason for using the workflow stated and leads to the original problem of reintegration (this also used to happen when I worked from NAS only).

I've attached a screenshot of my catalog system which may (or may not) help you.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 25020
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2022, 07:23:20 AM »
Brian,

If you're only using the Collections feature, then having separate catalogs won't be a solution for your shared computer environment.
Please explain why it won't be, bearing in mind I want a catalog of say 'Transport' images broken down to collections of say 'Flight', Waterborne', 'Rail' etc.

I mean that you'll still have to reintegrate when using a catalog that has changed on another computer.  You had wanted to avoid reintegration in your shared computer environment.

Given your desire to have these hierarchical categories, why don't you use hierarchical (what we call Structured) keywords?  If you were to apply the structured keywords:

Transport | Flight
Transport | Waterborne
Transport | Rail
etc.

...to your images, then you'd see that structure automatically in the Browse/IPTC/Keywords tree (or in a similar Filter) without having to create Collections manually.  If you had to rebuild your catalog or if you decided to use different software, your structure would still be intact.

Just a thought/suggestion for a different approach.

In what aspect doesn't it work across a network?  It's capable of working with your images on a network.
I can see the 'Navigator' images from the NAS okay on both Macs. It's the Catalogs/Collections side that I have been advised not to use on the NAS as the number of read/write operations can be too much for the connections. This is the reason for using the workflow stated and leads to the original problem of reintegration (this also used to happen when I worked from NAS only).

Beyond the poor performance nature of NASes, they tend to randomly drop connections.  This would be catastrophic for the database.  It would soon become corrupted due to partial updates (not finalized) prior to the drop of the connection.  This is the primary reason we suggest that you don't put your catalogs on a NAS (or any other network resource).

-Kirk

Offline BrianK

  • Newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2022, 04:14:55 AM »
Okay, I am at a loss to know what the problem is. One theory is that the difference between the iMac and MacBook Pro is causing the laptop to not do reintegrate properly. I have tried many different approaches and setting changes on the laptop all without success. I also changed the catalogs so that I could do the same procedure (reintegrate) on the iMac and it went as I would expect i.e. quickly without any problem.
Don't know if anyone else is reading this that may have experience on Macs but if anyone can shed some light on it I would be grateful.

Offline Kirk Baker

  • Senior Software Engineer
  • Camera Bits Staff
  • Superhero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 25020
    • View Profile
    • Camera Bits, Inc.
Re: Catalog Reintegration
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2022, 07:40:24 AM »
Brian,

Okay, I am at a loss to know what the problem is. One theory is that the difference between the iMac and MacBook Pro is causing the laptop to not do reintegrate properly. I have tried many different approaches and setting changes on the laptop all without success. I also changed the catalogs so that I could do the same procedure (reintegrate) on the iMac and it went as I would expect i.e. quickly without any problem.
Don't know if anyone else is reading this that may have experience on Macs but if anyone can shed some light on it I would be grateful.

Are these problems only happening when a catalog is stored on a Google Drive?

-Kirk