applying keywords

[ramblinwreck]

[running PM 4.6.5 on OSX 10.6.4]

Hi,

I'm trying to lean how to use the keywords panel to speed up the process of adding keywords to my images (have been typing them manually from the IPTC info window). I have to admit, as a former Aperture user, I'm really struggling to figure out how to this efficiently. I'll describe the problem I'm having and I hope you guys can tell me how best to solve it in PM.

What I'd like to be able to do is to add keywords to images (one at a time, or a few at at time) within the contact sheet window, i.e. *without* having to leave the contact sheet view (i.e. no use of the IPTC info window or stationary pad). At first glance it seems the Keywords Panel (CMD+K) is what I want, but I cannot figure out how to use it effectively.

I have two problems:

1. When I use CMD+K to bring up the keywords panel, it lists ALL of my keywords (hundreds, if not thousands). Lets say I want to add keywords to photos from a family vacation, in that case I really only need 20 or so keywords, and it's really slow to search for those out of that huge list. It would seem that the snapshot feature is what I need but I'm struggling there too (see #2). Is there a way to define "sets" (e.g. of a small number) of keywords to appear in the keywords panel, where I can switch between them depending on what kind of photos I'm keywording? The point is that this puts a relatively small manageable number of relevant keywords in the list which is much much faster to work with than looking at my whole list.

2. OK, so I tried to set up a "vacation" snapshot. Here's what I did.
- select photo in contact sheet
- click "i" to enter IPTC info window
- click drop down arrow next to keywords, then 'edit keywords', now I'm in "IPTC Keywords"
- Current Keywords List is empty (expected), Master Keywords List is populated (hundreds of keywords, expected).
- In the Master Keywords List I CMD+click 5 keywords to select them, click snapshot button -> save -> "vacation" -> OK.
  These are 5 keywords I want to use frequently for vacation photos, for example.
- Click OK to leave IPTC and go back to contact sheet.
- Select multiple photos
- CMD+K to bring up Keywords Panel
- Keywords panel appears to have ALL (hundreds) of keywords in list
- I want to bring up my set of 5 keywords I saved in the "vacation" snapshot
- I click the snapshot button in the keywords panel, and I see my "vacation" snapshot with other snapshots
- I click "vacation"
- Now, *ALL* (hundreds) of keywords are highlighted in the top list portion, and all (hundreds) have been added to the "Applying" section.

This did NOT do what I wanted it to do. I was hoping that by selecting my pre-saved snapshot, that it would merely show the 5 keywords I had saved off in that snapshot. Have I misunderstood this function?

It almost seems like when I click snapshot and select a previously saved snapshot in the keywords panel, it overwrites that snapshot with ALL keywords in the list. ??

Where am I going wrong? I fear that I may be missing something very fundamental.

Thanks
Chris

[Kirk Baker]

Chris,

No need to go into the IPTC Info and its Keywords dialog.  All can be done from the Keywords panel.

Command-click the items you want from your Master list (the hundreds/thousands you described before).  Click on the 'Snapshot from selected' button.  Name it 'Vacation'.  Now click on the snapshot button and choose the Vacation item.  By default the entire list will be selected.  Command-click on any items you don't want for the selected photo(s) and they will be deselected.  Once you're happy with your selection, click on the 'Apply to selected photos' button.

HTH,

-Kirk

[ramblinwreck]

Hi Kirk,

Thanks much. That works.

But it begs the question - why can't I choose the vacation snapshot that I created in the IPTC Info / Keywords dialog. For example, I just followed your steps and created 'newvacation' (group of 5 or so keywords). I still had 'vacation' from yesterday (generated the "old" way I reported originally). When I click on the snapshot button from the Keywords panel I can see both items, but only 'newvacation' (generated following your instructions) gives the desired behavior. Why?

In other words - inside the keywords panel I can see snapshots generated from either the keywords panel (your method) or in the IPTC Info / Keywords dialog (my original method), but only the former gives the behavior your describe.

The reason I ask is because I envision creating snapshots in both places, yet it's not possible to discern where they were created when actually trying to load them...

I appreciate your help. I'm still learning how to use PM to it's fullest/fastest extent!

Chris

[Kirk Baker]

Chris,

But it begs the question - why can't I choose the vacation snapshot that I created in the IPTC Info / Keywords dialog. For example, I just followed your steps and created 'newvacation' (group of 5 or so keywords). I still had 'vacation' from yesterday (generated the "old" way I reported originally). When I click on the snapshot button from the Keywords panel I can see both items, but only 'newvacation' (generated following your instructions) gives the desired behavior. Why?

The snapshots in the IPTC Keywords save the entire list, not the selection.  You would have to move/copy selected keywords from the Master list to the left list and make a snapshot from the left side.  Then you would have to cancel the dialog so you don't actually apply those keywords to the photo you're working with.

-Kirk

[ramblinwreck]

Got it, Kirk. Thanks.

[ramblinwreck]

Kirk,

Sorry to resurrect this old thread.

Another question.

OK so now I've got my "vacation" snapshot (created from the Keywords Panel per your instructions above), and I'm going through my photos adding keywords, and at some point I realize I'd like to add another keyword (or two or three) from my master keyword list to my vacation snapshot. How does one do this?

I know I can add another keyword manually and the save over the existing snapshot, but I'd like to pull from my master list to help ensure I don't manually add something that overlapping with something I've already got in my master list.

Chris

[Kirk Baker]

Chris,

Another question.

OK so now I've got my "vacation" snapshot (created from the Keywords Panel per your instructions above), and I'm going through my photos adding keywords, and at some point I realize I'd like to add another keyword (or two or three) from my master keyword list to my vacation snapshot. How does one do this?

I know I can add another keyword manually and the save over the existing snapshot, but I'd like to pull from my master list to help ensure I don't manually add something that overlapping with something I've already got in my master list.

The snapshot files are the same format for both columns, so you can select your entire Vacation list on the right column (Master) and Copy ( <- ) it to the left (Current) column.  Then save the Current column as a snapshot named 'Vacation'.  Then from the snapshot menu (left side) hold down the shortcut key ( Option on Mac, Shift on Windows) and choose the 'Vacation' snapshot.  Your OS window ( Finder on Mac, Windows Explorer on Windows ) will come forward and will have your 'Vacation.snap' file selected.  You can copy it (or move it if you like) from where it is to the "IPTCKeywordsSettings" folder and you will be prompted to replace it.  Do so.  Now switch back to PM and load the 'Vacation' snapshot from the Master snapshot button.  It should now be updated like you wanted it.

HTH,

-Kirk

[ramblinwreck]

Afraid I'm just not getting it, Kirk.

Your instructions mention two columns which tells me you're talking about the "IPTC Keywords" dialog. In my scenario, all I've got open is a contact sheet and the keywords panel (based on your previous recommendations, i.e. my vacation snapshot is created by CMD+clicking keywords out of the master list in the keywords panel). Is there no way for me to achieve what I want to do entirely in the Keywords panel? It seems a bit convoluted to enter the IPTC Keywords dialog, and then use Finder to manually move .snap files. (?)

Also, in your most recent instructions, I don't actually see where I would ever add "new" keywords to my vacation snapshot (?)

Let me try another more specific example:

- Say I'm working in a single contact sheet with vacation photos, with keywords panel open (no use of stationary pad or "IPTC info" dialog at this particular point)
- In keywords panel, I load "vacation" snapshot, say this loads (for simple example) 5 keywords into the list (Hawaii, Kauai, Poipu, Surf, Bodyboard)
- Now I select image(s) from the contact sheet, CMD+click Hawaii, Kauai, Bodyboard from Keywords Panel, then "apply to selected photos"
- Repeat process for other photos. So far so good.
- Now, I see an image where I'd like to add a keyword "Beach", so I'd like to add Beach to my vacation snapshot (where Beach MAY or MAY NOT already exist in my master keyword list), and then continue working the way I was up to this point

Can I do this? [and can I do it without leaving the KW panel or contact sheet?]

If your previous instructions actually cover this case then I apologize, but it's not apparent to me where "Beach" would actually get added to the vacation snapshot using the instructions you gave.

A side question - is what I'm trying to do unusual? This seems like a basic thing users would want, and something that can be accomplished with very few keystrokes in Aperture. Is there a video tutorial anywhere that covers this? I have watched a few video tutorials but they mainly focus on variables / code replacement (which is awesome, BTW) but unfortunately not the kind of thing I'm struggling with here.

[ramblinwreck]

Kirk,

I sent you a personal message with a link to a video that might help better explain what I'm after.

Thanks
Chris

[ramblinwreck]

Hi Kirk,

I've been playing with it some and I think I understand the limitations now. I've found that I can pull up a snapshot, and then add keywords to the keywords panel list as I go (as I find more keywords that need to be added). This gets me most of what I want, I just can't easily update that snapshot to include the new words I added to the list. I'll post this as a feature request. Thanks.

Chris