Color difference - Canon DPro and PhotoMechanic and Capture NX2...

[Del]

Hi,
I posted this in the Nikonian's forum and although there were a number of "readers" I didn't get any comments that would help me understand the situation I have.  Perhaps this is the place.  Any help appreciated. //Del

Hi,
I need some help with color balance.

My daughter took some pictures outdoors with her xti, CR2 RAW files.

I've opened them in Canon's Digital Pro 3.4 and saved them as both TIF and JPG. They all look ok in the Canon software, and the JPG looks the same opening it in Windows viewer.

When I open them in PhotoMechanic, ViewNX and Capture NX2, there is a distinct yellowish cast compared to the Canon Digital Pro view...I can look at them side by side, same monitor.

The Canon sw is set for sRGB and the others are set to open with whatever is in the file data. (I've tried changing that to Nikon sRGB, etc., can't see the difference easily).

One the test image I'm using, I can make the image as viewed in NX2 similar to the Canon image by inserting a color balance adjustment step and setting: Red, -15; Green, -15; and Blue, +15.
As another approach, I used the white control point on the only "white" in the picture, a button, and reducing the luminosity.

I must be doing something wrong but it sure isn't clear to me. Any advice or help would really be appreciated as the images are from a family funeral.
Thx//Del

[Kirk Baker]

Del,

I need some help with color balance.

My daughter took some pictures outdoors with her xti, CR2 RAW files.

I've opened them in Canon's Digital Pro 3.4 and saved them as both TIF and JPG. They all look ok in the Canon software, and the JPG looks the same opening it in Windows viewer.

When I open them in PhotoMechanic, ViewNX and Capture NX2, there is a distinct yellowish cast compared to the Canon Digital Pro view...I can look at them side by side, same monitor.

The Canon sw is set for sRGB and the others are set to open with whatever is in the file data. (I've tried changing that to Nikon sRGB, etc., can't see the difference easily).

One the test image I'm using, I can make the image as viewed in NX2 similar to the Canon image by inserting a color balance adjustment step and setting: Red, -15; Green, -15; and Blue, +15.
As another approach, I used the white control point on the only "white" in the picture, a button, and reducing the luminosity.

I must be doing something wrong but it sure isn't clear to me. Any advice or help would really be appreciated as the images are from a family funeral.

What ICC profile have you embedded into your images?  You can have PM embed a different profile into your images with the "Embed ICC Profile into JPEGs..." command on the Tools menu.

-Kirk

[Del]

Hi Kirk,
PM reads the ICC Profile as: sRGB IEC61966-2.1.  PM is set to default to this if the file is indeterminate.

I just tried opening the images with PSP X2, it is warmer still, not that desirable.

I don't know what is "right" just don't understand the differences...and I'm willing to experiment.

Thx for the quick response.
//Del

[Kirk Baker]

Del,

PM reads the ICC Profile as: sRGB IEC61966-2.1.  PM is set to default to this if the file is indeterminate.

I just tried opening the images with PSP X2, it is warmer still, not that desirable.

I don't know what is "right" just don't understand the differences...and I'm willing to experiment.

Is your monitor color calibrated with a colorimeter?

How do the images look if you turn off color management in PM?  You can turn it on/off in the tool bar above the Contact Sheet and in the tool bar in the Preview window.

-Kirk

[Del]

Kirk,
I didn't calibrate the monitor, it's a Samsung and came with the Falcon Northwest PC in July.
I'll try the color management step first thing tomorrow morning.
//Del

[Del]

Kirk,
To "turn off color management" I went to Edit, Preferences, Color Management tab, unchecked to boxes: Color manage thumbnails for display; Color manage previews for display.

When I did this, the contact images and the preview images changed to match what I saw on the Canon software.

Now I'm really confused...please help me to understand what is going on.
Thx//Del

[Kirk Baker]

Del,

To "turn off color management" I went to Edit, Preferences, Color Management tab, unchecked to boxes: Color manage thumbnails for display; Color manage previews for display.

When I did this, the contact images and the preview images changed to match what I saw on the Canon software.

Now I'm really confused...please help me to understand what is going on.

The profile currently assigned to your monitor is not a good match for its color gamut.  It sounds like Canon's software isn't doing color management at all.  You're going to have to get a colorimeter and calibrate your monitor (or leave color management off.)  They can be had for as low as $50.00 US.

-Kirk

[Del]

Kirk,
I found a couple of things. In the Canon software I found that one of the defaults had to be changed.  It you go to: Tools – Preferences – Color Management you’ll get a window that has three areas.  The middle area is called “Color Matching Settings” and is used for the display and printer.  The default for the display is sRGB...I thought pretty standard; however, you can use the Windows default or select the driver for your particular monitor.  I did the latter, set it for my Samsung 245T,and the Canon image really changed...in fact it’s a reasonable rendition of the applications I’ve tried.

I agree about calibrating the monitor and will try to figure out what equipment to get.  Including, which have the most straightforward instructions for it's use and knowing what to do with any affected applications.

Thanks again for helping me to understand the parameters and pointing me to the solution.
//Del

[Del]

Kirk,
An update.  I purchased a Colormunki, profiled the monitor, and after making my normal share of mistakes, I have the monitor profiled, etc.  Now the applications all display the same image with the same color. Amazing or obvious, whichever...
Thank you for steering me to the best answer.
//Del
p.s., the mistake that I made several times deals with the control on the Colormunki.  You have to rotate the control from calibrate to the monitor mode.  No big thing except it's very easy to press the center part of the control which changes "things."  It's not an easy control to rotate so the tendency is to use "edges" to get some leverage...and you inadvertently push the center control switch.

[Kirk Baker]

Del,

An update.  I purchased a Colormunki, profiled the monitor, and after making my normal share of mistakes, I have the monitor profiled, etc.  Now the applications all display the same image with the same color. Amazing or obvious, whichever...
Thank you for steering me to the best answer.
//Del
p.s., the mistake that I made several times deals with the control on the Colormunki.  You have to rotate the control from calibrate to the monitor mode.  No big thing except it's very easy to press the center part of the control which changes "things."  It's not an easy control to rotate so the tendency is to use "edges" to get some leverage...and you inadvertently push the center control switch.

Great!  Thanks for the follow-up.

-Kirk